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Post by Moses on Oct 30, 2013 11:27:41 GMT -5
Rulers? Lol
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Post by dsummoner on Oct 31, 2013 14:34:18 GMT -5
There are black boxes and then there are black boxes. The use of the term for the technology that resides in motor vehicles, now, is a gross misnomer. The proper term is 'event data recorder' (EDR). Most commonly, the EDR is found within the airbag control module (ACM) subsystem. Certain Ford vehicles also capture data through the power train control module (PCM). Recorded data is of two types: the first is for deployment level events in which a collision results in supplemental restraint system (SRS) (i.e. airbag) deployment. The second is for non-deployment events: events that 'wake-up' the deployment algorithm. Currently, the extent of data recorded varies by manufacturer, year and model. Data is further divided into pre-collision data, which generally includes vehicle speed, based upon readings from the vehicle speed sensors (at the drive wheels), and collision data, which generally includes vehicle change in velocity or deceleration (or both) during a prescribed time frame (this data is from the ACM itself). This will, however, be standardized in regards to minimum reporting requirements for the 2014 MY. The data does not include GPS coordinate data and does not record data (expect for PCM data which is on a circular buffer) unless the deployment algorithm is awakened. This is entirely different from a mileage logger or GPS position logger. I work with this data on a daily basis as part and parcel of my work in the field of accident reconstruction and would be happy to answer any questions related to it.
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Post by middleoftheroad on Nov 1, 2013 7:52:53 GMT -5
There are black boxes and then there are black boxes. The use of the term for the technology that resides in motor vehicles, now, is a gross misnomer. The proper term is 'event data recorder' (EDR). Most commonly, the EDR is found within the airbag control module (ACM) subsystem. Certain Ford vehicles also capture data through the power train control module (PCM). Recorded data is of two types: the first is for deployment level events in which a collision results in supplemental restraint system (SRS) (i.e. airbag) deployment. The second is for non-deployment events: events that 'wake-up' the deployment algorithm. Currently, the extent of data recorded varies by manufacturer, year and model. Data is further divided into pre-collision data, which generally includes vehicle speed, based upon readings from the vehicle speed sensors (at the drive wheels), and collision data, which generally includes vehicle change in velocity or deceleration (or both) during a prescribed time frame (this data is from the ACM itself). This will, however, be standardized in regards to minimum reporting requirements for the 2014 MY. The data does not include GPS coordinate data and does not record data (expect for PCM data which is on a circular buffer) unless the deployment algorithm is awakened. This is entirely different from a mileage logger or GPS position logger. I work with this data on a daily basis as part and parcel of my work in the field of accident reconstruction and would be happy to answer any questions related to it. I think I remember reading somewhere that the length of time for which the"memory" of events is retained is very short at the current time; minutes. Is that accurate or am I "misremembering" once again? |
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Post by aponderer on Nov 1, 2013 7:58:01 GMT -5
There are black boxes and then there are black boxes. The use of the term for the technology that resides in motor vehicles, now, is a gross misnomer. The proper term is 'event data recorder' (EDR). Most commonly, the EDR is found within the airbag control module (ACM) subsystem. Certain Ford vehicles also capture data through the power train control module (PCM). Recorded data is of two types: the first is for deployment level events in which a collision results in supplemental restraint system (SRS) (i.e. airbag) deployment. The second is for non-deployment events: events that 'wake-up' the deployment algorithm. Currently, the extent of data recorded varies by manufacturer, year and model. Data is further divided into pre-collision data, which generally includes vehicle speed, based upon readings from the vehicle speed sensors (at the drive wheels), and collision data, which generally includes vehicle change in velocity or deceleration (or both) during a prescribed time frame (this data is from the ACM itself). This will, however, be standardized in regards to minimum reporting requirements for the 2014 MY. The data does not include GPS coordinate data and does not record data (expect for PCM data which is on a circular buffer) unless the deployment algorithm is awakened. This is entirely different from a mileage logger or GPS position logger. I work with this data on a daily basis as part and parcel of my work in the field of accident reconstruction and would be happy to answer any questions related to it. I think I remember reading somewhere that the length of time for which the"memory" of events is retained is very short at the current time; minutes. Is that accurate or am I "misremembering" once again? Sorry, but the President has you beat in the "misremembering" department...   |
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Post by dsummoner on Nov 1, 2013 9:50:03 GMT -5
There are black boxes and then there are black boxes. The use of the term for the technology that resides in motor vehicles, now, is a gross misnomer. The proper term is 'event data recorder' (EDR). Most commonly, the EDR is found within the airbag control module (ACM) subsystem. Certain Ford vehicles also capture data through the power train control module (PCM). Recorded data is of two types: the first is for deployment level events in which a collision results in supplemental restraint system (SRS) (i.e. airbag) deployment. The second is for non-deployment events: events that 'wake-up' the deployment algorithm. Currently, the extent of data recorded varies by manufacturer, year and model. Data is further divided into pre-collision data, which generally includes vehicle speed, based upon readings from the vehicle speed sensors (at the drive wheels), and collision data, which generally includes vehicle change in velocity or deceleration (or both) during a prescribed time frame (this data is from the ACM itself). This will, however, be standardized in regards to minimum reporting requirements for the 2014 MY. The data does not include GPS coordinate data and does not record data (expect for PCM data which is on a circular buffer) unless the deployment algorithm is awakened. This is entirely different from a mileage logger or GPS position logger. I work with this data on a daily basis as part and parcel of my work in the field of accident reconstruction and would be happy to answer any questions related to it. I think I remember reading somewhere that the length of time for which the"memory" of events is retained is very short at the current time; minutes. Is that accurate or am I "misremembering" once again? Currently, there is wide variance based on each make, model and year range. In most cases, the precollision data is 5 seconds worth, reported at 1 Hz sampling (1 sample per second) or 2 seconds worth, reported at 10 Hz sampling (1 sample every 0.1 seconds). The collision data is generally on the order of 150 to 300 milliseconds (0.15 to 0.30 seconds), reported at 10 Hz sampling. Certain years of the Ford Crown Victoria will store a lot more data. Ford PCM data can run as long as 25 seconds but it is on a circular buffer (it has to be downloaded before the vehicle is powered on following a collision or else the data starts to be overwritten). For those that are interested, see 49 CFR Part 563: www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/rulings/edrnprm4--june1/index.html#tblTable I under Part IIA lists the required elements that are to be recorded under the new regulations (the NPM has been finalized). |
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Post by aponderer on Nov 1, 2013 11:37:59 GMT -5
Would those certain years of the Crown Vic enhanced capability correspond to the Police Interceptor versions of the Crown Vic?
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Post by dsummoner on Nov 1, 2013 12:02:49 GMT -5
Would those certain years of the Crown Vic enhanced capability correspond to the Police Interceptor versions of the Crown Vic? Not specifically. I can pull up the year range if you are interested. |
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Post by aponderer on Nov 1, 2013 15:39:57 GMT -5
Would those certain years of the Crown Vic enhanced capability correspond to the Police Interceptor versions of the Crown Vic? Not specifically. I can pull up the year range if you are interested. I was just curious. I thought that the police might want to be able to extract that data for "defense" purposes in cases where police vehicles were involved in accidents. |
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Post by dsummoner on Nov 1, 2013 15:42:35 GMT -5
Not specifically. I can pull up the year range if you are interested. I was just curious. I thought that the police might want to be able to extract that data for "defense" purposes in cases where police vehicles were involved in accidents. Unfortunately or fortunately, there is no difference in regards to the ACM on the police interceptor edition v. the 'normal' edition of the vehicle. The dashcams, something under the control of the relevant agencies, would be something that would work for the above. |
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Post by Moses on Nov 2, 2013 12:52:41 GMT -5
I was just curious. I thought that the police might want to be able to extract that data for "defense" purposes in cases where police vehicles were involved in accidents. Unfortunately or fortunately, there is no difference in regards to the ACM on the police interceptor edition v. the 'normal' edition of the vehicle. The dashcams, something under the control of the relevant agencies, would be something that would work for the above. So Is the paranoia justified?  |
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Post by dsummoner on Nov 2, 2013 14:29:17 GMT -5
Unfortunately or fortunately, there is no difference in regards to the ACM on the police interceptor edition v. the 'normal' edition of the vehicle. The dashcams, something under the control of the relevant agencies, would be something that would work for the above. So Is the paranoia justified? Given the record of open perjury, lying and secrecy of the Federal regime coupled with the 'information awareness' ops of local law enforcement, exemplified by unhinged and unabated license plate scanning... one has zero trust in government when it comes to turning mileage trackers into GPS trackers. Just remember, '9/11' is the answer to all questions. One would not be opposed to mileage trackers under the following conditions: 1. Any politician even suggesting that GPS tracking be enabled is immediately stripped of his or her position and any benefits and pensions. 2. Any government employee, at any level, or contractor of government, found to be involved in enabling GPS tracking is subject to unappealable sentence by death upon conviction. 3. All taxes on fuel are eliminated. 4. There are absolutely no social justice provisions, which means that the gutterfilth poor pay their fair share (i.e. the same charge as everyone else, on a per mile basis). |
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Post by Moses on Nov 2, 2013 14:35:35 GMT -5
So Is the paranoia justified? Given the record of open perjury, lying and secrecy of the Federal regime coupled with the 'information awareness' ops of local law enforcement, exemplified by unhinged and unabated license plate scanning... one has zero trust in government when it comes to turning mileage trackers into GPS trackers. Just remember, '9/11' is the answer to all questions. One would not be opposed to mileage trackers under the following conditions: 1. Any politician even suggesting that GPS tracking be enabled is immediately stripped of his or her position and any benefits and pensions. 2. Any government employee, at any level, or contractor of government, found to be involved in enabling GPS tracking is subject to unappealable sentence by death upon conviction. 3. All taxes on fuel are eliminated. 4. There are absolutely no social justice provisions, which means that the gutterfilth poor pay their fair share (i.e. the same charge as everyone else, on a per mile basis). Well thanks for the thorough answer! I notice you threw in a few of your fav causes in there. Similar to a bill loaded with pork! |
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Post by dsummoner on Nov 2, 2013 14:41:28 GMT -5
Given the record of open perjury, lying and secrecy of the Federal regime coupled with the 'information awareness' ops of local law enforcement, exemplified by unhinged and unabated license plate scanning... one has zero trust in government when it comes to turning mileage trackers into GPS trackers. Just remember, '9/11' is the answer to all questions. One would not be opposed to mileage trackers under the following conditions: 1. Any politician even suggesting that GPS tracking be enabled is immediately stripped of his or her position and any benefits and pensions. 2. Any government employee, at any level, or contractor of government, found to be involved in enabling GPS tracking is subject to unappealable sentence by death upon conviction. 3. All taxes on fuel are eliminated. 4. There are absolutely no social justice provisions, which means that the gutterfilth poor pay their fair share (i.e. the same charge as everyone else, on a per mile basis). Well thanks for the thorough answer! I notice you threw in a few of your fav causes in there. Similar to a bill loaded with pork! I but simply provided a scenario under which converting a simple mileage tracker into a GPS tracker would be untenable. If the function of the mileage tracker is to replace the extant gas tax then the gas tax needs to go. As far as social(ist) justice goes... such syphilitic nonsense is always something that is to be opposed and aborted even before it can graft onto the uterine lining. |
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Post by Moses on Nov 2, 2013 14:59:12 GMT -5
Well thanks for the thorough answer! I notice you threw in a few of your fav causes in there. Similar to a bill loaded with pork! I but simply provided a scenario under which converting a simple mileage tracker into a GPS tracker would be untenable. If the function of the mileage tracker is to replace the extant gas tax then the gas tax needs to go. As far as social(ist) justice goes... such syphilitic nonsense is always something that is to be opposed and aborted even before it can graft onto the uterine lining. Those taxes are used for road and highway repair right? Highways and roads are expensive to keep up. Maybe private industries should take over the business and you just pay them? |
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Post by dsummoner on Nov 2, 2013 19:08:54 GMT -5
I but simply provided a scenario under which converting a simple mileage tracker into a GPS tracker would be untenable. If the function of the mileage tracker is to replace the extant gas tax then the gas tax needs to go. As far as social(ist) justice goes... such syphilitic nonsense is always something that is to be opposed and aborted even before it can graft onto the uterine lining. Those taxes are used for road and highway repair right? Highways and roads are expensive to keep up. Maybe private industries should take over the business and you just pay them? 'Those taxes' are to be replaced by the mileage tax and implemented in the most just of matter (on a use basis). If you can't pay or don't wish to pay then you should not be force to pay and nor should be allowed access to said service(s). If you wish to grant access to the vermin class, then access should be purchased with your funds alone (along with the funds of like minded enablers). |
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Post by Moses on Nov 2, 2013 19:25:05 GMT -5
Those taxes are used for road and highway repair right? Highways and roads are expensive to keep up. Maybe private industries should take over the business and you just pay them? 'Those taxes' are to be replaced by the mileage tax and implemented in the most just of matter (on a use basis). If you can't pay or don't wish to pay then you should not be force to pay and nor should be allowed access to said service(s). If you wish to grant access to the vermin class, then access should be purchased with your funds alone (along with the funds of like minded enablers). You are talking serious redtape to keep track of all that. Someone got to pay those bureaucrats. It's a form of socialism you want roads we need roads again why not private industry doing it and you pay them? I'm not really ready to pay people to go through everyone's life and see if they drive or not and if they should pay taxes on roads are not seems like a lot of work I don't know maybe a category on your tax file? They bust you like they do witheveryone else if you're doing something illegal I guess. I think those are really support the military and those who support highways and the fact the government builds and pays for them it's kind of a quandary for true libertarians it is a dependence on the government |
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Post by dsummoner on Nov 2, 2013 20:28:49 GMT -5
'Those taxes' are to be replaced by the mileage tax and implemented in the most just of matter (on a use basis). If you can't pay or don't wish to pay then you should not be force to pay and nor should be allowed access to said service(s). If you wish to grant access to the vermin class, then access should be purchased with your funds alone (along with the funds of like minded enablers). You are talking serious redtape to keep track of all that. Someone got to pay those bureaucrats. It's a form of socialism you want roads we need roads again why not private industry doing it and you pay them? I'm not really ready to pay people to go through everyone's life and see if they drive or not and if they should pay taxes on roads are not seems like a lot of work I don't know maybe a category on your tax file? They bust you like they do witheveryone else if you're doing something illegal I guess. I think those are really support the military and those who support highways and the fact the government builds and pays for them it's kind of a quandary for true libertarians it is a dependence on the government It is actually quite easy to keep track of 'all of that.' In the People's Republic, the infrastructure is already in place for the toll roads and fast track lanes on the basis of transponders. Use of said toll roads and fast track lanes is on the basis of pay for play. One would be perfectly content to see a private sector roadway alternative if such were proposed absent corporate cronyism and collusion with government (aka Kelo v. City of New London). One does not need a bureaucracy to go through anyone's life in regards to roadway access. A simple transponder would work just fine. Those that use the roads without paying for access would be subject to something benign such as Shari'a punishments for spreading corruption among the land. I have no problems with government as a service provider. My issue is one of forced participation and extortion. |
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