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Post by Ranger John on Feb 3, 2018 20:21:02 GMT -5
www.nationalreview.com/article/456089/memo-released-what-should-come-nextwww.vox.com/2018/2/2/16957588/nunes-memo-released-full-text-read-pdf-declassifiedThe crux of the claims are as follows: Several notable partisans at the FBI (Strzok, Lisa Page, McCabe, Ohr and Rosenstein among others) used the still unverified and highly partisan Steele dossier as the foundation of their request to obtain a wiretap on Carter Page without explaining that the dossier was funded by the Clinton campaign as oppo research. In short, the Clinton campaign and Obama administration colluded to weapomize the FBI against an opposition party presidential campaign. For now, the Nunes Memo is being claimed as a partisan, cherry picked document. Interestingly though, no one is disputing the basic facts of the claims. Only that somehow they have been manipulated to create a false impression. If this is so, the FBI needs to produce the FISA warrant applications, and the Democrats need to explain and document how the Nunes Memo is misleading.
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Post by palealeman on Feb 3, 2018 22:09:37 GMT -5
Come on, RJ, stop using your unthinking partisan eyesight. Carter Page was on the FBI's watch list 2 or 3 years ago before any of this happened. The Nunes memo is a wonderful exercise in fiction. The Steele dossier -- which still may prove to be accurate -- was never used to get this FISA warrant. You should know that . . . unless you want to remain an unthinking partisan.
Nunes needs to realize that the Congress is an independent branch of government, and that his job is not to be in bed with the President.
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Post by Ranger John on Feb 4, 2018 11:21:53 GMT -5
Come on, RJ, stop using your unthinking partisan eyesight. Carter Page was on the FBI's watch list 2 or 3 years ago before any of this happened. The Nunes memo is a wonderful exercise in fiction. The Steele dossier -- which still may prove to be accurate -- was never used to get this FISA warrant. You should know that . . . unless you want to remain an unthinking partisan. Nunes needs to realize that the Congress is an independent branch of government, and that his job is not to be in bed with the President. LMAO! You think the Nunes memo is fiction but the Steele Dossier is real? The FBI has been allegedly trying to verify the Steele Dossier for 2 years, and can't. The Nunes Memo hasn't even been labeled as false by the FBI, which has the documents to prove it one way or the other should it so choose. |
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Post by palealeman on Feb 4, 2018 11:32:05 GMT -5
Reading is fundamental, RJ. Please keep trying to do so.
The Nunes memo has been compared to a book report written by someone who never read the book. It's a blatantly partisan attempt to protect the President and to deflect from Mr. Mueller's investigation.
I don't know if the Steele dossier is accurate or not. But just because some of it may not be true does not mean that all of it is false == that's a false jump in logic, which you'd possible understand if you ever studied logic or philosophy.
And the FBI did comment on the Nunes memo, as you should know if you read. I'll not bother to repeat what the FBI said, since you should be able to find it yourself. But the FBI did express grave concerns about the accuracy of the memo.
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Post by Ranger John on Feb 4, 2018 11:54:36 GMT -5
Reading is fundamental, RJ. Please keep trying to do so. The Nunes memo has been compared to a book report written by someone who never read the book. It's a blatantly partisan attempt to protect the President and to deflect from Mr. Mueller's investigation. I don't know if the Steele dossier is accurate or not. But just because some of it may not be true does not mean that all of it is false == that's a false jump in logic, which you'd possible understand if you ever studied logic or philosophy. And the FBI did comment on the Nunes memo, as you should know if you read. I'll not bother to repeat what the FBI said, since you should be able to find it yourself. But the FBI did express grave concerns about the accuracy of the memo. Yes. The hyper partisan media and the accused FBI are claiming it's partisan. Which is just Democrats being Democrats. In other words we've just got partisans making partisan statements. The thing is, the FBI has the documents to prove or disprove the Nunes Memo should it choose to do so. So we shall see. The Steele Dossier, by contrast can not be verified at all. |
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Post by palealeman on Feb 4, 2018 17:41:12 GMT -5
And you, the unthinking partisan, think that it's accurate. Note that the memo notes (at the end) that Page was being investigated back in 2013. It's reasonable to assume that a request for a warrant would not need to rely on the Steele dossier, since there were 3 years of investigation to fall back on.
And, though you continue with your unthinking partisan mindset that the Steele dossier cannot be verified at all, the real truth (I know you have trouble with the truth) is that most of us have no idea if it can be verified or not. Perhaps large parts of it have been verified. But the FBI and intelligence committees don't make that sort of information public.
But most reliable news sources -- the kind you probably don't read or listen to -- have conclued that the Nunes memo is mostly fiction and, in fact, should have no impact on the Mueller investigation.
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Post by Ranger John on Feb 4, 2018 20:04:42 GMT -5
And you, the unthinking partisan, think that it's accurate. Note that the memo notes (at the end) that Page was being investigated back in 2013. It's reasonable to assume that a request for a warrant would not need to rely on the Steele dossier, since there were 3 years of investigation to fall back on. And, though you continue with your unthinking partisan mindset that the Steele dossier cannot be verified at all, the real truth (I know you have trouble with the truth) is that most of us have no idea if it can be verified or not. Perhaps large parts of it have been verified. But the FBI and intelligence committees don't make that sort of information public. But most reliable news sources -- the kind you probably don't read or listen to -- have conclued that the Nunes memo is mostly fiction and, in fact, should have no impact on the Mueller investigation. Again, this is simple: if it isn't accurate the FBI has an opportunity to put up or shut up. They can prove it's BS, even if they have to redact parts of it. They've got the same ability with the Steele Dossier. They won't with either because they CAN'T. You have no idea who is reliable and who isn't. Hell you still think Steele is reliable. How many times do these people need to make a fool out of you before you stop accepting everything they tell you? |
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Post by redleg on Feb 4, 2018 22:06:01 GMT -5
Come on, RJ, stop using your unthinking partisan eyesight. Carter Page was on the FBI's watch list 2 or 3 years ago before any of this happened. The Nunes memo is a wonderful exercise in fiction. The Steele dossier -- which still may prove to be accurate -- was never used to get this FISA warrant. You should know that . . . unless you want to remain an unthinking partisan. Nunes needs to realize that the Congress is an independent branch of government, and that his job is not to be in bed with the President. Sorry, but it wasn't 'accurate' when they used it to get a warrant to spy on the Trump campaign. Nor did they tell the FISC that it was a hit piece of opposition research, paid for by The Felon's campaign. Nor did they tell the FISC that the "corroborating evidence" was a yahoo article that Steele had written. So, they get a piece of absolute fiction, use it to get a FISC warrant, and use the author of the fiction to "corroborate" it. The FBI and the Party of the KKK need to realize that the law applies to them as much as it does to anyone else. Page was "on the radar" because he had worked in Russia for a long time. So far, they have charged him with nothing, implicated him in nothing, and have nothing indicating that he was anywhere near as much in collusion with the Russians as The Felon and her Communist cabal were. |
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Post by redleg on Feb 4, 2018 22:11:49 GMT -5
Reading is fundamental, RJ. Please keep trying to do so. The Nunes memo has been compared to a book report written by someone who never read the book. It's a blatantly partisan attempt to protect the President and to deflect from Mr. Mueller's investigation. I don't know if the Steele dossier is accurate or not. But just because some of it may not be true does not mean that all of it is false == that's a false jump in logic, which you'd possible understand if you ever studied logic or philosophy. And the FBI did comment on the Nunes memo, as you should know if you read. I'll not bother to repeat what the FBI said, since you should be able to find it yourself. But the FBI did express grave concerns about the accuracy of the memo. No, it's just another nail in the coffin of the witch hunt instigated by a lie from The Felon. There is nothing at all implicating anyone in Trump's campaign with "collusion". There are $14 million pieces of evidence that The Felon did collude with Russia to affect the election. You are just mad because your criminal masters are getting caught in their sedition, and may very well go to prison. Including The Felon and The Puppet, since both were neck deep in the sedition. And, by the way, sedition carries the death penalty. How far do you think the trail will lead if the DOJ charges one of your heros, and uses that? How loud will they sing? Ever wonder what the first black President will do in a prison cell? Nunes DID read the book, which is why the Party of the KKK is so hysterical about him releasing the memo. There are no lies they can tell, no spin they can create, that will absolve their partisan hit men in the FBI of the crimes they have committed. All of it has proven false, which is why it's a crime for them to use it for a warrant, and a further crime for them to use circular "evidence" as proof. It was all a lie by The Felon, and everyone involved should now be facing the hangman's rope. |
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Post by redleg on Feb 4, 2018 22:17:07 GMT -5
And you, the unthinking partisan, think that it's accurate. Note that the memo notes (at the end) that Page was being investigated back in 2013. It's reasonable to assume that a request for a warrant would not need to rely on the Steele dossier, since there were 3 years of investigation to fall back on. And, though you continue with your unthinking partisan mindset that the Steele dossier cannot be verified at all, the real truth (I know you have trouble with the truth) is that most of us have no idea if it can be verified or not. Perhaps large parts of it have been verified. But the FBI and intelligence committees don't make that sort of information public. But most reliable news sources -- the kind you probably don't read or listen to -- have conclued that the Nunes memo is mostly fiction and, in fact, should have no impact on the Mueller investigation. He was being "investigated" for 4 years, but they had to get a faked "dossier" before they could get a warrant. That means they had nothing at all to tie him to anything he's being accused of. Nothing. So, they invented a dossier, lied to the FISC, and used that warrant to spy on the Trump campaign. That's sedition. If anything in that 'dossier' had been verified, it would have been leaked to CNN or the NYT, and been on the front pages. The FBI and CIA have leaked everything they had that they thought would damage Trump, since the day he was elected. Both have become nothing more than secret police arms of the Party of the KKK. Just like the memo, which Shiff would have leaked immediately had there been anything wrong or false about it. They are lying again, trying to cover their crimes. The ones you consider "reliable" are the propaganda arms of the Party of the KKK. They are lying, because they know it's not only true, but accurate. Even the LR media can't spin it, so they are ignoring it. |
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Post by Ranger John on Feb 5, 2018 9:11:46 GMT -5
This whole Russia thing seems to be to Trump what the Birther thing was to Obama. Except the Birthers at least had that book jacket from Obama that claimed he was Kenyan.
By contrast, all the information we have on the Trump-Russia story appears to be Trump telling the Russians to go away.
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Post by redleg on Feb 5, 2018 10:36:10 GMT -5
This whole Russia thing seems to be to Trump what the Birther thing was to Obama. Except the Birthers at least had that book jacket from Obama that claimed he was Kenyan. By contrast, all the information we have on the Trump-Russia story appears to be Trump telling the Russians to go away. Another situation started by The Felon. |
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Post by palealeman on Feb 5, 2018 11:51:34 GMT -5
This whole Russia thing seems to be to Trump what the Birther thing was to Obama. Except the Birthers at least had that book jacket from Obama that claimed he was Kenyan. By contrast, all the information we have on the Trump-Russia story appears to be Trump telling the Russians to go away. And just what information do we have, RJ? I'd guess that Mr. Mueller has quite a bit of information at this point, not just on Trump but on members of his campaign staff (4 of whom have been charged so far). And that he'll release it as and when necessary. And, since Trump is not the most truthful person in Washington, him telling the Russians to go away might just be a ploy to continue to try to divert any investigation from him. He continues to evade and obfuscate. My guess is that he's involved in some way, shape, or form, and answering questions or giving truthful answers could be harmful to him. Again, we'll have to wait and see. |
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Post by redleg on Feb 5, 2018 12:15:22 GMT -5
This whole Russia thing seems to be to Trump what the Birther thing was to Obama. Except the Birthers at least had that book jacket from Obama that claimed he was Kenyan. By contrast, all the information we have on the Trump-Russia story appears to be Trump telling the Russians to go away. And just what information do we have, RJ? I'd guess that Mr. Mueller has quite a bit of information at this point, not just on Trump but on members of his campaign staff (4 of whom have been charged so far). And that he'll release it as and when necessary. And, since Trump is not the most truthful person in Washington, him telling the Russians to go away might just be a ploy to continue to try to divert any investigation from him. He continues to evade and obfuscate. My guess is that he's involved in some way, shape, or form, and answering questions or giving truthful answers could be harmful to him. Again, we'll have to wait and see. And what were they charged with? Process crimes, about things from long before the election. Not that any of it matters, since every charge will be thrown out. Fruit of the poison tree, remember? Mueller had no authority, since his mandate was illegal. And all of the "evidence" he might have was illegally gained. Of course, the fact that The Felon actually paid the Russians to affect the election is irrelevant to you. Trump might have actually said hello to a Russian sometime in his life, so that has to be investigated. |
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Post by Ranger John on Feb 5, 2018 13:07:15 GMT -5
This whole Russia thing seems to be to Trump what the Birther thing was to Obama. Except the Birthers at least had that book jacket from Obama that claimed he was Kenyan. By contrast, all the information we have on the Trump-Russia story appears to be Trump telling the Russians to go away. And just what information do we have, RJ? I'd guess that Mr. Mueller has quite a bit of information at this point, not just on Trump but on members of his campaign staff (4 of whom have been charged so far). And that he'll release it as and when necessary. And, since Trump is not the most truthful person in Washington, him telling the Russians to go away might just be a ploy to continue to try to divert any investigation from him. He continues to evade and obfuscate. My guess is that he's involved in some way, shape, or form, and answering questions or giving truthful answers could be harmful to him. Again, we'll have to wait and see. If Mueller had anything, it would be in the media, or there would be indictments by now, for something more substantial than lying to the FBI. There aren't even any rumors in the media about specific wrong doing... other than wrongdoing by the FBI. There was clearly some of that. As things stand, redleg is correct. We've got process crimes, and unrelated charges from things that took place when Flynn was working with the Podestas. If you want to keep waiting... I suggest holding your breath. Fitzmas has come and gone yet again with nothing to show for it. |
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Post by palealeman on Feb 5, 2018 15:26:13 GMT -5
Why do you keep thinking that any information Mueller has would be leaked? I have more confidence in the FBI than that. Maybe the reason no information has been leaked is because Mueller runs a tight ship, as opposed to the person in charge of the White House. There have been indictments, and I expect there will be more. However, as I am not privy to Mr. Mueller's investigation, I have no idea just what information he has or when he will indict again. I'm just biding my time.
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Post by palealeman on Feb 5, 2018 17:23:52 GMT -5
What's really amazing, and at the same time pathetic, in this whole situation is that Nunes released a memo criticizing the obtaining of a FISA warrant for using improper information when, in fact, Nunes admits that he never read the FISA warrant! How can someone comment intelligently on a document that he has never read? Of course, conservatives aren't much for commenting intelligently on anything, so what else is new here?
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Post by Ranger John on Feb 5, 2018 18:04:03 GMT -5
Why do you keep thinking that any information Mueller has would be leaked? I have more confidence in the FBI than that. Maybe the reason no information has been leaked is because Mueller runs a tight ship, as opposed to the person in charge of the White House. There have been indictments, and I expect there will be more. However, as I am not privy to Mr. Mueller's investigation, I have no idea just what information he has or when he will indict again. I'm just biding my time. Because neither Mueller nor the FBI have been running a "tight ship". There have been a crazy number of anonymous source stories in the media. Granted, many of them have been proven bogus. But the previous administration FBI was also known for smearing Republicans and fabricating phony investigations. |
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Post by Ranger John on Feb 5, 2018 18:10:48 GMT -5
What's really amazing, and at the same time pathetic, in this whole situation is that Nunes released a memo criticizing the obtaining of a FISA warrant for using improper information when, in fact, Nunes admits that he never read the FISA warrant! How can someone comment intelligently on a document that he has never read? Of course, conservatives aren't much for commenting intelligently on anything, so what else is new here? That isn't necessary when Andrew McCabe testifies under oath that there isn't enough information outside the Steele Dossier to show probable cause and justify the FISA warrant. Nunes says the FBI didn't have anything beyond the Steele Dossier because that's what the FBI told him. |
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Post by redleg on Feb 6, 2018 9:54:20 GMT -5
Why do you keep thinking that any information Mueller has would be leaked? I have more confidence in the FBI than that. Maybe the reason no information has been leaked is because Mueller runs a tight ship, as opposed to the person in charge of the White House. There have been indictments, and I expect there will be more. However, as I am not privy to Mr. Mueller's investigation, I have no idea just what information he has or when he will indict again. I'm just biding my time. Could it be because every tidbit that might damage Trump HAS BEEN LEAKED? Schiff couldn't wait to run from his committee meetings to CNN to leak info, most of it wrong. Mueller has had so many leaks he would sink in a bathtub. There have been no indictments dealing with the alleged purpose of his "investigation", and if the victims of his illegal 'investigation' have any intelligent lawyers, not a single charge will ever see a trial, because the lawyers will get all the charges thrown out. Fruit of the poison tree, don't you know? |
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Post by redleg on Feb 6, 2018 9:56:51 GMT -5
What's really amazing, and at the same time pathetic, in this whole situation is that Nunes released a memo criticizing the obtaining of a FISA warrant for using improper information when, in fact, Nunes admits that he never read the FISA warrant! How can someone comment intelligently on a document that he has never read? Of course, conservatives aren't much for commenting intelligently on anything, so what else is new here? That isn't necessary when Andrew McCabe testifies under oath that there isn't enough information outside the Steele Dossier to show probable cause and justify the FISA warrant. Nunes says the FBI didn't have anything beyond the Steele Dossier because that's what the FBI told him. But of course, the FBI must have been lying about that, because they are so pure that they would never accede to a Party of the KKK President telling them to spy on a rival campaign. Never. Just like the IRS would never attack political opponents of The Puppet, and The Felon would never use her illegal server to sell classified information to the Russians. |
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Post by Ranger John on Feb 6, 2018 10:32:14 GMT -5
That isn't necessary when Andrew McCabe testifies under oath that there isn't enough information outside the Steele Dossier to show probable cause and justify the FISA warrant. Nunes says the FBI didn't have anything beyond the Steele Dossier because that's what the FBI told him. But of course, the FBI must have been lying about that, because they are so pure that they would never accede to a Party of the KKK President telling them to spy on a rival campaign. Never. Just like the IRS would never attack political opponents of The Puppet, and The Felon would never use her illegal server to sell classified information to the Russians. The FBI is less of a problem than the media. Most of the people involved in the collusion investigation including Comey and Strzok have either said there's nothing there, or privately admitted there probably is no case. The media on the other hand is hyperventilating to the point where it believes nearly every nonsense story fed to it by their completely unreliable anonymous sources. |
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Post by palealeman on Feb 6, 2018 13:57:39 GMT -5
Why do you keep thinking that any information Mueller has would be leaked? I have more confidence in the FBI than that. Maybe the reason no information has been leaked is because Mueller runs a tight ship, as opposed to the person in charge of the White House. There have been indictments, and I expect there will be more. However, as I am not privy to Mr. Mueller's investigation, I have no idea just what information he has or when he will indict again. I'm just biding my time. Because neither Mueller nor the FBI have been running a "tight ship". There have been a crazy number of anonymous source stories in the media. Granted, many of them have been proven bogus. But the previous administration FBI was also known for smearing Republicans and fabricating phony investigations. Absolute BS, RJ. If you think that the FBI is a partisan organization, you're showing how much of an unthinking partisan you really are. And you show that Trump is winning -- discredit the press and set yourself as the only source of truth, discredit law enforcement -- and pretty soon we have the totalitarian government that you seem to want so much. Pathetic. Please learn to read, think, think critically. |
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Post by Ranger John on Feb 6, 2018 14:26:07 GMT -5
Because neither Mueller nor the FBI have been running a "tight ship". There have been a crazy number of anonymous source stories in the media. Granted, many of them have been proven bogus. But the previous administration FBI was also known for smearing Republicans and fabricating phony investigations. Absolute BS, RJ. If you think that the FBI is a partisan organization, you're showing how much of an unthinking partisan you really are. And you show that Trump is winning -- discredit the press and set yourself as the only source of truth, discredit law enforcement -- and pretty soon we have the totalitarian government that you seem to want so much. Pathetic. Please learn to read, think, think critically. We've seen more than enough proof of partisanship at the FBI. Strzok, Page, McCabe, Ohr. The list is long and depressing. Go ahead. Keep your head buried... wherever it's buried. Being blind to your own partisanship (and projecting it on others) is one of your defining characteristics. |
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Post by palealeman on Feb 6, 2018 17:15:13 GMT -5
Why not ask some FBI agents how they feel about being called partisan? The ones that I have spoken with are vehement that there is no partisanship in how things are carried out. People may have their own viewpoints, but they generally don't interfere with their work. I believe it was McCabe who said he did not even vote to avoid any appearance of partisanship.
But keep your head buried and continue to ignore your own unthinking partisanship. It's what we expect from you. Anything for the right and to keep our country moving backward.
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