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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2013 10:35:45 GMT -5
sourceEither it is a bad law but the progs don't want to go there or it is an expensive boondoggle.
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Post by douger on Nov 13, 2013 10:38:10 GMT -5
sourceEither it is a bad law but the progs don't want to go there or it is an expensive boondoggle. I do remember voices predicting both. But since they were ignorant racists, their views didn't count.
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Post by drjohnnyfever on Nov 13, 2013 11:12:23 GMT -5
sourceEither it is a bad law but the progs don't want to go there or it is an expensive boondoggle. I do remember voices predicting both. But since they were ignorant racists, their views didn't count. And they still are ignorant racists.....the light bringer will fix this.....just you wait.....besides-it's the "settled law of the land". FOREWARD!
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Post by breakingbad on Nov 13, 2013 12:10:09 GMT -5
One thing that is being overlooked by the politicians that are scrambling to come up with feel-good legislation that allows everyone to keep their existing plans: the only way this can happen is to force insurance companies to offer below-market plans, since Obamacare is now driving up the cost. This also will end in disaster, like everything else our government touches.
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Post by Evil Yoda on Nov 13, 2013 12:30:37 GMT -5
Obama will never sign legislation like that. Obamacare depends on widespread enrollment to work. Indeed, their biggest fear about this website is that it will discourage sufficient numbers to sign up that the law will fail in one of a number of possible ways, all of which would lead back to an expensive bailout for the insurance industry - with which it would even be hard to argue, inasmuch as it would be the government's mistake.
If voters are smart in '14 they will punish the party that handed us this mess severely.
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Post by howarewegoingtopay on Nov 13, 2013 12:39:33 GMT -5
Obama will never sign legislation like that. Obamacare depends on widespread enrollment to work. Indeed, their biggest fear about this website is that it will discourage sufficient numbers to sign up that the law will fail in one of a number of possible ways, all of which would lead back to an expensive bailout for the insurance industry - with which it would even be hard to argue, inasmuch as it would be the government's mistake. If voters are smart in '14 they will punish the party that handed us this mess severely.I think that will not happen, voters are obviously not smart.
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Post by dogbert on Nov 13, 2013 12:47:01 GMT -5
Obama will never sign legislation like that. Obamacare depends on widespread enrollment to work. Indeed, their biggest fear about this website is that it will discourage sufficient numbers to sign up that the law will fail in one of a number of possible ways, all of which would lead back to an expensive bailout for the insurance industry - with which it would even be hard to argue, inasmuch as it would be the government's mistake. If voters are smart in '14 they will punish the party that handed us this mess severely. Yoda you are scaring me, when you make the statement that "if the voters are smart" have you seen the "voters" out there?!?!? We are doomed!
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Post by Evil Yoda on Nov 13, 2013 12:49:02 GMT -5
Granted many people are really dumb. If only there was a plague that was more likely to carry off the stupid. Wait... there kinda is! Just legalize drug use...
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Post by howarewegoingtopay on Nov 13, 2013 12:58:54 GMT -5
Granted many people are really dumb. If only there was a plague that was more likely to carry off the stupid. Wait... there kinda is! Just legalize drug use... Well not really, if it was legalized it would probably be safer. Remember stupid people seem to be a protected class nowadays with no consequences applied for their stupidity.
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Post by Evil Yoda on Nov 13, 2013 12:59:42 GMT -5
Okay, then, just decriminalize it.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2013 14:45:41 GMT -5
Granted many people are really dumb. If only there was a plague that was more likely to carry off the stupid. Wait... there kinda is! Just legalize drug use...
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Post by darave on Nov 14, 2013 11:23:48 GMT -5
The only solution I see for people keeping their plans that have gone way up is have the government subsidize the difference. IF your paying 500 per month and it goes up to $900.00 then you should be cut a check for $400.00 to keep your insurance.Like healthcare welfare for the middle class.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2013 11:25:33 GMT -5
The only solution I see for people keeping their plans that have gone way up is have the government subsidize the difference. IF your paying 500 per month and it goes up to $900.00 then you should be cut a check for $400.00 to keep your insurance.Like healthcare welfare for the middle class. And what losers get to pick up this tab? How many monthly checks for $400 are you personally willing to write?
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Post by douger on Nov 14, 2013 11:30:47 GMT -5
The only solution I see for people keeping their plans that have gone way up is have the government subsidize the difference. IF your paying 500 per month and it goes up to $900.00 then you should be cut a check for $400.00 to keep your insurance.Like healthcare welfare for the middle class. And what losers get to pick up this tab? How many monthly checks for $400 are you personally willing to write? Something similar seems to be one of the options on the table right now. Paying the premiums may be the easy part compared to cracking the new, higher deductible nut.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2013 11:40:20 GMT -5
And what losers get to pick up this tab? How many monthly checks for $400 are you personally willing to write? Something similar seems to be one of the options on the table right now. Paying the premiums may be the easy part compared to cracking the new, higher deductible nut. And waiting in the wings is network coverage. One of the few commented on results of Obamacare so far is how many people are being signed up for Medicaid. SourceGood news, right? Not exactly. sourceSo the big question here is, "Will adding hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of new Medicaid patients to the rolls help or hurt this problem?" I'll wager it makes it worse.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2013 11:44:46 GMT -5
One more thing. One of the reactionary ideas being floated around is Medicaid for all. How does this effect the 3 in 10 doctors that won't accept Medicaid patients? Is choice going to once again be replaced with force?
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Post by douger on Nov 14, 2013 11:45:30 GMT -5
Something similar seems to be one of the options on the table right now. Paying the premiums may be the easy part compared to cracking the new, higher deductible nut. And waiting in the wings is network coverage. One of the few commented on results of Obamacare so far is how many people are being signed up for Medicaid. SourceGood news, right? Not exactly. sourceSo the big question here is, "Will adding hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of new Medicaid patients to the rolls help or hurt this problem?"I'll wager it makes it worse. Not to mention the price that will be extracted on the deficit and debt to add even more participants to a system whose costs are already out of control.
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Post by breakingbad on Nov 14, 2013 11:59:39 GMT -5
You know, I knew, like many others, that this would be a disaster, and would cause all kinds of untold unintended consequences. But never in my wild dreams did I think it was going to be this screwed up.
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Post by redleg on Nov 15, 2013 13:20:01 GMT -5
One more thing. One of the reactionary ideas being floated around is Medicaid for all. How does this effect the 3 in 10 doctors that won't accept Medicaid patients? Is choice going to once again be replaced with force? Especially since The Puppet has already cut $716 billion out of Medicare, and intends to simply not pay doctors to "save" money in health care.
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Post by Ranger John on Nov 15, 2013 18:20:28 GMT -5
Obama will never sign legislation like that. Obamacare depends on widespread enrollment to work. Indeed, their biggest fear about this website is that it will discourage sufficient numbers to sign up that the law will fail in one of a number of possible ways, all of which would lead back to an expensive bailout for the insurance industry - with which it would even be hard to argue, inasmuch as it would be the government's mistake. If voters are smart in '14 they will punish the party that handed us this mess severely. You know, a lot of us saw this coming in 2012, and tried to punish the Democrats then. But I remember a bunch of people here who didn't want to vote for Mitt Romney.
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Post by Evil Yoda on Nov 15, 2013 19:38:49 GMT -5
You know, a lot of us saw this coming in 2012, and tried to punish the Democrats then. But I remember a bunch of people here who didn't want to vote for Mitt Romney. Mitt wouldn't have changed anything. He gave Massachusetts this kind of system. And he had other problems, character problems, into the bargain. I refuse to cast a vote for a man I don't respect because the other man is worse.
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Post by Ranger John on Nov 15, 2013 20:07:43 GMT -5
You know, a lot of us saw this coming in 2012, and tried to punish the Democrats then. But I remember a bunch of people here who didn't want to vote for Mitt Romney. Mitt wouldn't have changed anything. He gave Massachusetts this kind of system. And he had other problems, character problems, into the bargain. I refuse to cast a vote for a man I don't respect because the other man is worse. You can believe that Mitt would have repealed it or not. I think he would have been under enormous pressure to get rid of it. Bottom line though, Obama definitely was going to keep going down this path - and you didn't even try to get the country off it. And Mitt is at least competent enough that healthcare.gov probably would have worked.
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Post by Evil Yoda on Nov 15, 2013 22:05:06 GMT -5
When someone worth voting for comes along, I'll vote for them. Voting for people who aren't worth your vote, because they're not the other guy, is why we get the deplorable assortment of reprobates we've seen the last several years. I won't buy in.
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Post by drjohnnyfever on Nov 15, 2013 22:18:18 GMT -5
You know, I knew, like many others, that this would be a disaster, and would cause all kinds of untold unintended consequences. But never in my wild dreams did I think it was going to be this screwed up. I've seen my share of cf's in my time but this sure does seem to set a whole new standard-and this is just the beginning-just wait until the employer mandate kicks in-they'll be finding congress critters hanging from light poles. The sheer breadth and depth of incompetence is staggering and barry's presser yesterday was bordering on incomprehensible. I can't decide if barry's channeling steve erkel or alfred e neuman......and he runs our foreign policy also.....heaven help us.
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Post by kemmer on Nov 16, 2013 0:06:57 GMT -5
You know, I knew, like many others, that this would be a disaster, and would cause all kinds of untold unintended consequences. But never in my wild dreams did I think it was going to be this screwed up. I've seen my share of cf's in my time but this sure does seem to set a whole new standard-and this is just the beginning-just wait until the employer mandate kicks in-they'll be finding congress critters hanging from light poles. The sheer breadth and depth of incompetence is staggering and barry's presser yesterday was bordering on incomprehensible. I can't decide if barry's channeling steve erkel or alfred e neuman......and he runs our foreign policy also.....heaven help us. I think he believes it's the proper role of government to bring about Utopia on Earth. I think he believes that is possible, and if some must be sacrificed to the cause, then they deserved to be sacrificed. He knew he was lying when he made the "you can keep your current insurance" promise. He had to lie, because most people were happy with their insurance. Add his other promise, that the average family's premium would fall $2500/year (with their current coverage, remember) and the general population figured it'd be a good thing to get everyone some coveage. Even the midnight budget resolution sneak-passage would have been impossible if the 85% of Americans who were content with their insurance got wind of the planned changes. Nobody in Congress could have voted for it and kept his seat. In Obama's defense, I think he believes that everyone will be thrilled with more "social justice." Plus, he has religious faith in preventive care-- and in the magic of computerized medical records. That's where he expects these huge cost savings to come from. Perhaps the website debacle will disabuse him of his faith in computers-- but I doubt it. He knows how to tweet, but there's no way he could design Twitter. All he really knows is computers = magic. (That puts him in company of the Wall Street bankers and bond rating agencies who came a cropper trusting computer-generated synthetic CDO's. Irony, anyone?)
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