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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2014 9:55:38 GMT -5
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Post by rocketwolf on Aug 24, 2014 10:10:09 GMT -5
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Post by middleoftheroad on Aug 24, 2014 11:00:18 GMT -5
It's difficult addressing this topic without turning this thread into a flame war. Do you think IJAN might contribute to the establishment of peace in Gaza by encouraging Hamas to permanently stop launching missiles into Israel? Or perhaps, encouraging Hamas not to stage its launchers in community settings? Perhaps they can encourage Hamas to not execute 18 Palestinians simply because Hamas thinks they cooperated with the Israelis? I find just a bit of irony that IJAN issues a statement condemning genocide when ISIS is showing the world on a daily basis the true eveil that is genocide. |
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Post by vosa on Aug 24, 2014 11:21:26 GMT -5
"The IJAN, founded in 2008, is a small left-wing organisation which is highly critical of Israel. The IJAN, founded in 2008, is a small left-wing organisation which is highly critical of Israel."
Of the 317 left wing people listed in the article, exactly 2 live in Israel.
Truly, hell hath no fury like the uninvolved.
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Post by rocketwolf on Aug 24, 2014 11:31:31 GMT -5
"The IJAN, founded in 2008, is a small left-wing organisation which is highly critical of Israel. The IJAN, founded in 2008, is a small left-wing organisation which is highly critical of Israel." Of the 317 left wing people listed in the article, exactly 2 live in Israel. Truly, hell hath no fury like the uninvolved. Thank you I was wondering how many of the members actually lived there. Protesting in the US is a lot safer than in Gaza or Israel. (98% of the time)
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2014 11:34:52 GMT -5
I would have said that being a Holocaust survivor, or relative of one, would epitomize more 'involvement' and weight of any poster on here.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2014 11:45:02 GMT -5
It's difficult addressing this topic without turning this thread into a flame war. Do you think IJAN might contribute to the establishment of peace in Gaza by encouraging Hamas to permanently stop launching missiles into Israel? Or perhaps, encouraging Hamas not to stage its launchers in community settings? Perhaps they can encourage Hamas to not execute 18 Palestinians simply because Hamas thinks they cooperated with the Israelis? I find just a bit of irony that IJAN issues a statement condemning genocide when ISIS is showing the world on a daily basis the true eveil that is genocide. Without turning this topic into a flame war, it would be better to address this topic directly and not attempt to divert it with the usual 'what if Hamas...?' trick. Yes, ISIS is an evil entity and are attempting a 'genocide' of their own. However, this thread topic is about the Israeli 'genocide' of Palestinians in Gaza, I would appreciate it if you would stay on the topic of this thread. |
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Post by rocketwolf on Aug 24, 2014 11:55:15 GMT -5
It is good that you used "what they call Israel's "genocide" in Gaza" because I'm not sure it qualifies.
If the Israelis are attempting genocide they are being extremely inefficient.
If you were to say, "the Israelis are waging a war on a stealthy terror group hiding among the populace of Gaza."
I would agree.
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Post by vosa on Aug 24, 2014 12:11:58 GMT -5
It's difficult addressing this topic without turning this thread into a flame war. Do you think IJAN might contribute to the establishment of peace in Gaza by encouraging Hamas to permanently stop launching missiles into Israel? Or perhaps, encouraging Hamas not to stage its launchers in community settings? Perhaps they can encourage Hamas to not execute 18 Palestinians simply because Hamas thinks they cooperated with the Israelis? I find just a bit of irony that IJAN issues a statement condemning genocide when ISIS is showing the world on a daily basis the true eveil that is genocide. Without turning this topic into a flame war, it would be better to address this topic directly and not attempt to divert it with the usual 'what if Hamas...?' trick. Yes, ISIS is an evil entity and are attempting a 'genocide' of their own. However, this thread topic is about the Israeli 'genocide' of Palestinians in Gaza, I would appreciate it if you would stay on the topic of this thread. The reason we can't stay on the topic of Israeli 'genocide' of Palestinians in Gaza is because there is no Israeli 'genocide' of Palestinians in Gaza. And "what if Hamas" is not a trick it's a question; one you refuse to answer because if you did provide an answer based on the facts of the situation your whole genocide claim would collapse. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2014 13:07:02 GMT -5
Is anyone here going to take the topic head on are you all going to attempt to divert it?
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Post by husagafella on Aug 24, 2014 13:22:34 GMT -5
Is anyone here gong to take the topic head on are you all going to attempt to divert it? And what "topic" would that be? That no group is totally monolithic in thought? Really, 40 holocaust survivors and 280 of their descendants. Think there might be a couple ten thousand survivors and their descendants that have the opposite point of view. You need to come up with a different shtick than "those horrible jews". |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2014 13:31:56 GMT -5
Is anyone here gong to take the topic head on are you all going to attempt to divert it? And what "topic" would that be? That no group is totally monolithic in thought? Really, 40 holocaust survivors and 280 of their descendants. Think there might be a couple ten thousand survivors and their descendants that have the opposite point of view. You need to come up with a different shtick than "those horrible jews". "Shtick?"... it's a BBC article, I have made no comment on it yet, in fact no one has yet, care to be the first other than kneejerk defending "those horrible Jews"? |
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Post by husagafella on Aug 24, 2014 13:38:21 GMT -5
Just because you find a new article with a couple people supporting a position that supports your hatred of anything Jewish in the Middle East doesn't make it a new topic. Folks can post hundreds of articles supporting the Jewish position in this conflict.
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Post by vosa on Aug 24, 2014 14:15:32 GMT -5
And what "topic" would that be? That no group is totally monolithic in thought? Really, 40 holocaust survivors and 280 of their descendants. Think there might be a couple ten thousand survivors and their descendants that have the opposite point of view. You need to come up with a different shtick than "those horrible jews". "Shtick?"... it's a BBC article, I have made no comment on it yet, in fact no one has yet, care to be the first other than kneejerk defending "those horrible Jews"? I commented on the so-called "genocide". What part of it ain't happening don't you understand? |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2014 14:44:11 GMT -5
"Shtick?"... it's a BBC article, I have made no comment on it yet, in fact no one has yet, care to be the first other than kneejerk defending "those horrible Jews"? I commented on the so-called "genocide". What part of it ain't happening don't you understand? The part that it is happening. You saying it ain't so, doesn't make it go away. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2014 14:49:22 GMT -5
Just because you find a new article with a couple people supporting a position that supports your hatred of anything Jewish in the Middle East doesn't make it a new topic. Folks can post hundreds of articles supporting the Jewish position in this conflict. Just because you and Jews generally shut down all talk an criticism of anything Israeli doesn't make it go away. You guys need to look reality in the face, Israel is criticized simply because it warrants criticism, you screaming that down doesn't make it not so. |
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Post by middleoftheroad on Aug 24, 2014 15:11:11 GMT -5
It's difficult addressing this topic without turning this thread into a flame war. Do you think IJAN might contribute to the establishment of peace in Gaza by encouraging Hamas to permanently stop launching missiles into Israel? Or perhaps, encouraging Hamas not to stage its launchers in community settings? Perhaps they can encourage Hamas to not execute 18 Palestinians simply because Hamas thinks they cooperated with the Israelis? I find just a bit of irony that IJAN issues a statement condemning genocide when ISIS is showing the world on a daily basis the true eveil that is genocide. Without turning this topic into a flame war, it would be better to address this topic directly and not attempt to divert it with the usual 'what if Hamas...?' trick. Yes, ISIS is an evil entity and are attempting a 'genocide' of their own. However, this thread topic is about the Israeli 'genocide' of Palestinians in Gaza, I would appreciate it if you would stay on the topic of this thread. Your position precludes any reasonable discussion of the topic BE. There are two sets of forces involved in the Gaza conflict and you only want to discuss one; such a position is foolish. If the Israelis were truly interested in genocide, nothing Hamas could do could stop it. Nothing. Indeed, all of Hamas would barely be a speed bump to a genocide level advance of the IDF. Let's deal with your thread then. I reject the IJAN position of a genocide or even a massacre. What you see in the death of 2,000 people of Gaza is exactly what I told you we would see if the IDF had to bring ground forces to Gaza. What you also see is the inevitable result of what is essentially a gang of hoods taking on a field level army, and stationing their offensive weapons in neighborhoods. Nations have the right of self-defense and until Hamas stops firing unguided missiles, Israel will continue to defend itself. |
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Post by vosa on Aug 24, 2014 15:41:25 GMT -5
Just because you find a new article with a couple people supporting a position that supports your hatred of anything Jewish in the Middle East doesn't make it a new topic. Folks can post hundreds of articles supporting the Jewish position in this conflict. Just because you and Jews generally shut down all talk an criticism of anything Israeli doesn't make it go away. You guys need to look reality in the face, Israel is criticized simply because it warrants criticism, you screaming that down doesn't make it not so. OK BE, try to answer this one: Why does Israel want to eliminate all of the Palestinians? |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2014 15:56:21 GMT -5
Just because you and Jews generally shut down all talk an criticism of anything Israeli doesn't make it go away. You guys need to look reality in the face, Israel is criticized simply because it warrants criticism, you screaming that down doesn't make it not so. OK BE, try to answer this one: Why does Israel want to eliminate all of the Palestinians? For the same reason Germany wanted to eliminate all of the Jews ? |
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Post by Evil Yoda on Aug 24, 2014 16:58:59 GMT -5
Per dictionary.com
genocide
[jen-uh-sahyd]
1. the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group.
This is not what is happening in Gaza.
IJAN has taken this term, which has a specific meaning, and used it incorrectly. It's a political tactic because using the term allows one to create sensationalist press releases and headlines.
I disagree with some of what Israel is doing, but genocide, it ain't.
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Post by husagafella on Aug 24, 2014 17:09:29 GMT -5
Per dictionary.com genocide
[jen-uh-sahyd]
1. the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group.This is not what is happening in Gaza. IJAN has taken this term, which has a specific meaning, and used it incorrectly. It's a political tactic because using the term allows one to create sensationalist press releases and headlines. I disagree with some of what Israel is doing, but genocide, it ain't. Agree, of course it isn't genocide. When Baldie was asked why it was genocide he ascribes the Nazi's motives to the Jews. Despicable and shows why it is a waste of time to try to engage him in reasonable discourse. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2014 18:54:01 GMT -5
Per dictionary.com genocide
[jen-uh-sahyd]
1. the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group.This is not what is happening in Gaza. IJAN has taken this term, which has a specific meaning, and used it incorrectly. It's a political tactic because using the term allows one to create sensationalist press releases and headlines. I disagree with some of what Israel is doing, but genocide, it ain't. Agree, of course it isn't genocide. When Baldie was asked why it was genocide he ascribes the Nazi's motives to the Jews. Despicable and shows why it is a waste of time to try to engage him in reasonable discourse. The reason why it is not possible to have a reasonable discourse with you and people like you on the subject of Israel is because you will not accept any criticism of Israel. Your instant kneejerk reaction is to attack the messenger and close down the discussion and if possible the thread. What is despicable is the slaughter of more than 2100 Gazans by Israel and you not even acknowledging that fact. No one here has addressed the gross disproportionate response of Israel that continues, you all try to bury that... yeah, that's what's despicable. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2014 18:59:00 GMT -5
Per dictionary.com genocide
[jen-uh-sahyd]
1. the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group.This is not what is happening in Gaza. IJAN has taken this term, which has a specific meaning, and used it incorrectly. It's a political tactic because using the term allows one to create sensationalist press releases and headlines.I disagree with some of what Israel is doing, but genocide, it ain't. Oh, like the use of the term "anti-Semitism" you mean? |
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Post by middleoftheroad on Aug 24, 2014 19:34:28 GMT -5
Agree, of course it isn't genocide. When Baldie was asked why it was genocide he ascribes the Nazi's motives to the Jews. Despicable and shows why it is a waste of time to try to engage him in reasonable discourse. The reason why it is not possible to have a reasonable discourse with you and people like you on the subject of Israel is because you will not accept any criticism of Israel. Your instant kneejerk reaction is to attack the messenger and close down the discussion and if possible the thread. What is despicable is the slaughter of more than 2100 Gazans by Israel and you not even acknowledging that fact. No one here has addressed the gross disproportionate response of Israel that continues, you all try to bury that... yeah, that's what's despicable. What did you think would happen BE? Hamas launched missiles and Israel tried to destroy the launchers. The launchers were placed in community areas specifically for the purpose of creating this level of casualties. Hamas was given the opportunity to come to a cease fire and refused repeatedly. The IDF launched a ground attack to get to the tunnels, a ground attack everyone with half a brain knew would create this imbalance of casualties. Should the Israelis have gone in with out body armor? Smaller weapons to make things even? That's not how wars are fought BE. |
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Post by vosa on Aug 24, 2014 20:04:40 GMT -5
OK BE, try to answer this one: Why does Israel want to eliminate all of the Palestinians? For the same reason Germany wanted to eliminate all of the Jews ? Which is what? Because Jews were sending suicide bombers into German markets and on to German buses? Because Jews were firing rockets into Berlin and other German cities? Because Jews were dedicated to the total destruction of Germany? Because Netanyahu is another Hitler who is blaming the Palestinians for the last war that the Jews lost? Who is the Israeli equivalent of Julius Streicher? Who is the Israeli equivalent of Emon Goeth? Who is the Israeli equivalent of Reinhard Heydrich? When did Israel hold its version of the Wannsee Conference? Where are the trains to the concentrations camps? Surely you can come up with something better than "For the same reason Germany wanted to eliminate all of the Jews?" |
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