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Post by cyclegeek on Sept 10, 2014 8:47:10 GMT -5
Random thoughts … Isn’t this their personal life? Vick is back in the NFL. Other criminals are still playing today. There’s one video showing a single incident. Everything else is speculation. More to come … Random responses...
Isn't this their personal lives? It is but he chose to be in the public eye, have a public career and a VERY high paying job as a result. It's part of what comes with being in the NFL. You open yourself up to publicity and public ridicule. Ray Rice is a speaker against bullying.... what a hypocrite. The Rices were happy to be in the public eye as long as it was all rainbows and lollipops. Why not now? They need to suck it up, he needs to be a role model and they need to get help for the entire family.
Vick is back in the NFL. True and this makes me sick! IMHO... the NFL needs to review their rules regarding criminal activity, punishments, and being reinstated. When these guys are suspended for 2 or 3 games we all say that the $$$ means nothing to them. The punishments need to sting and reinstatement needs to come with education and classes with regard to whatever the crime was. They need to be more accountable. I'm not really familiar with the NFL's rules/punishments but they don't always seem very effective.
Other criminals are still playing - same response above.
Not sure what your last statement means. However, the video was enough. I believe the proper actions are being taken and disappointed it didn't happen sooner.
One final thought.... I do hope Ray Rice gets the help he needs so he can be a better husband and father. And I hope Janay gets help with her issues as well for the sake of her baby.
I agree with you about their personal lives. But some have used this, in the past, in defense of poor behavoir. Clinton immediately comes to mind. I agree they need to be accountable. IMHO, the current punishment is the correct punishment. My last comment was directed at all those folks speculating about how often Rice beat his wife, what MUST go on in their private lives, etc. It's all speculation.
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Post by The New Sheriff of Rock Ridge on Sept 10, 2014 9:20:42 GMT -5
As much as I love my Ravens, I don't go after sports autographs at all. I do however meets astronauts and get their signatures on books, photos, etc. I don't collect autographs either, but this football was offered to me by a relative.
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Post by davinci on Sept 10, 2014 10:30:29 GMT -5
Since this happened in a casino, what are the odds that the first time he ever hit her just happened to be caught on video? It's certainly possible, but one might argue that it isn't probable? Speculate is what people do. Speculate if their team will win, if so and so will bomb somebody, if somebody will get elected, arrested...and on and on.
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Post by Evil Yoda on Sept 10, 2014 10:45:49 GMT -5
As posted before. What did this video show you that anyone didn't already know? What this video did show was how the media can manipulate people. To me? It scuttled the notion that this was any sort of self-defense or accidental situation. It would have been far less offensive had she had a weapon, or if he had merely pushed her and she had hit her head. What it showed was that he wanted to hurt her and he did.
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Post by baltimorerayvn on Sept 10, 2014 12:16:12 GMT -5
This has shown me more than ever that the NFL needs to get it together and come up with consistent punishments for breaking their code of conduct. I feel for the wife and Ray for having their dirty laundry aired out again. If only he would have listened to his Kindergarten teacher (keep your hands to yourself and hitting isn't nice) maybe this wouldn't have happened. And, I don't know why she'd marry him after he hurt her, but that's what therapy is for and I hope she's seeing someone. Hopefully she'll learn about how much her life is valued and worth and no man or woman should be allowed to beat it out of her.
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Post by paintlady on Sept 10, 2014 13:34:23 GMT -5
uh...the nfl has a code of conduct? doesn't seem to me that they do...given the thugs and criminals they have on the different teams.
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Post by musicman on Sept 10, 2014 14:02:46 GMT -5
I know I'm going to take a boatload of heat for this but here goes.....
I do not like nor do I support what Ray Rice did to his girlfriend now wife. I think he should have been arrested and charges brought and now, with video evidence, convicted and sentenced for what he has done.
That being said, what the hell does this have to with football. He was not convicted and has no criminal record for it. And even if he was, the NFL's only action should have been to fire him if he were locked up and was unable to perform his duties. The NFL to these guys is a job.
Let's say for argument sake that a guy works for company X. That guy beats his wife in the head and knocks her unconscious. There are no charges filed and the guy shows up for work on Monday morning on time and performs his duties. The boss finds out about the incident and fires the guy. Does this guy have the right to sue his company? It would appear that it would put this employer in a poor position.
Again, what the hell does any of this crap have to do with football?
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Post by Evil Yoda on Sept 10, 2014 14:13:44 GMT -5
Again, what the hell does any of this crap have to do with football? The answer is cynical but true. The NFL is a brand. Players who behave as Ray did damage that brand. Perhaps the hypothetical employer does a lot of business with women who would be outraged - and seek a competitor - should they learn their supplier hires wife beaters. That's more analogous.
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Post by musicman on Sept 10, 2014 15:28:18 GMT -5
Again, what the hell does any of this crap have to do with football? The answer is cynical but true. The NFL is a brand. Players who behave as Ray did damage that brand. Perhaps the hypothetical employer does a lot of business with women who would be outraged - and seek a competitor - should they learn their supplier hires wife beaters. That's more analogous. And I don't disagree, but just because the employer deals with women, and those women are outraged, if there was nothing done to him by law enforcement or the criminal justice system, then the employer could be setting him/her self up for a problem. I understand the public might demand it, but does that make it ok to take some action. I've always had a hard time with any company, name any, it doesn't matter, inserting itself into the private lives of folks as long as the person is able to perform his/her job. The NFL is a company.
I'm not defending Ray. What he did was horrible, but doesn't have jack-squat to do with football.
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Post by davinci on Sept 10, 2014 15:40:03 GMT -5
That being said, what the hell does this have to with football. He was not convicted and has no criminal record for it. That's not exactly true; he was accepted into a pretrial intervention program for first-time offenders, which allows him to avoid jail time and could lead to the charge being erased from his record entirely.
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Post by alienrace on Sept 10, 2014 16:11:04 GMT -5
That is also the reason that the NFL never got to see the video - it was illegal for them to do so, since Rice can be brought back to court, essentially the case is still open.
In fact, TMZ might find themselves in some very hot water shortly, since their copy was illegally obtained.
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Post by alienrace on Sept 10, 2014 16:23:51 GMT -5
Here's a game changer - and bad news for Goodell - a law enforcement official claims under anonyminity that he sent the NFL a copy unauthorized. I don't know if it's verified, though he has a recording of a "secretary" saying "thanks, that was awful" on tape.
If true, Goodell might be done.
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Post by Ravenchamp on Sept 10, 2014 16:25:31 GMT -5
I just hope this zero tolerance act reaches out to any NFL player who has in their mind these horrific acts. Anyone who does this should be cut by default.
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Post by bowiebruce on Sept 10, 2014 16:40:51 GMT -5
Here's a game changer - and bad news for Goodell - a law enforcement official claims under anonyminity that he sent the NFL a copy unauthorized. I don't know if it's verified, though he has a recording of a "secretary" saying "thanks, that was awful" on tape. If true, Goodell might be done. Just heard about that. Wow. I swear to God, this whole sordid mess is really starting to turn me against the NFL. Go O's...
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Post by husagafella on Sept 10, 2014 16:49:41 GMT -5
That is also the reason that the NFL never got to see the video - it was illegal for them to do so, since Rice can be brought back to court, essentially the case is still open. In fact, TMZ might find themselves in some very hot water shortly, since their copy was illegally obtained. Man, you have been wrong at every turn on this one.
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Post by alienrace on Sept 10, 2014 17:09:55 GMT -5
That is also the reason that the NFL never got to see the video - it was illegal for them to do so, since Rice can be brought back to court, essentially the case is still open. In fact, TMZ might find themselves in some very hot water shortly, since their copy was illegally obtained. Man, you have been wrong at every turn on this one. So what? Does it give you joy?
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Post by alienrace on Sept 10, 2014 17:24:20 GMT -5
NFL still denying it. Something very fishy about it, that is for sure. Why do I have the feeling TMZ is somehow behind this latest "drama".
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Post by Evil Yoda on Sept 10, 2014 18:07:48 GMT -5
...but just because the employer deals with women, and those women are outraged, if there was nothing done to him by law enforcement or the criminal justice system, then the employer could be setting him/her self up for a problem... Most employer/employee relationships are "at will", meaning that you can leave whenever you want, or they can fire you whenever they want. In such a case, the employee has no recourse *unless* he can prove such discipline unevenly applied, or applied for reasons that have nothing to do with job performance, such as age. The latter usually requires a class of disciplined/fired employees. When there's a contract involved, as is the case with an NFL player, it will stipulate the conditions under which either party may terminate it. NFL contracts contain a certain amount of boilerplate language, the result of careful negotiation between the union and the league. You can bet that if the Ravens violated Ray's contract they'd be hearing from the NFLPA, because Ray would file a grievance and the union would have no choice but to back up, as that is one of its tentpole reasons to exist. So far, that has not happened. In addition, I am reasonably sure the Ravens would not take this action without assurances from their lawyers that it is legal and contractually allowed. In either case, harming a business (by damaging its brand) would certainly be on the list of offenses for which an employer can terminate an employee, unless the contract or employee manual (the document that specifies workplace practices for at-will employees) was written by someone stupid or inexperienced. I'm not defending Ray. What he did was horrible, but doesn't have jack-squat to do with football. I didn't suggest you were defending him. But what he did *does* have to do with football if it damages the NFL's brand, which was my earlier point. And it does, with all the people who object to wife beating/spousal abuse/violence against weaker people generally. You damage my business, you'll be out so fast all folks will see is zip lines.
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Post by Evil Yoda on Sept 10, 2014 18:07:57 GMT -5
...but just because the employer deals with women, and those women are outraged, if there was nothing done to him by law enforcement or the criminal justice system, then the employer could be setting him/her self up for a problem... Most employer/employee relationships are "at will", meaning that you can leave whenever you want, or they can fire you whenever they want. In such a case, the employee has no recourse *unless* he can prove such discipline unevenly applied, or applied for reasons that have nothing to do with job performance, such as age. The latter usually requires a class of disciplined/fired employees. When there's a contract involved, as is the case with an NFL player, it will stipulate the conditions under which either party may terminate it. NFL contracts contain a certain amount of boilerplate language, the result of careful negotiation between the union and the league. You can bet that if the Ravens violated Ray's contract they'd be hearing from the NFLPA, because Ray would file a grievance and the union would have no choice but to back up, as that is one of its tentpole reasons to exist. So far, that has not happened. In addition, I am reasonably sure the Ravens would not take this action without assurances from their lawyers that it is legal and contractually allowed. In either case, harming a business (by damaging its brand) would certainly be on the list of offenses for which an employer can terminate an employee, unless the contract or employee manual (the document that specifies workplace practices for at-will employees) was written by someone stupid or inexperienced. I'm not defending Ray. What he did was horrible, but doesn't have jack-squat to do with football. I didn't suggest you were defending him. But what he did *does* have to do with football if it damages the NFL's brand, which was my earlier point. And it does, with all the people who object to wife beating/spousal abuse/violence against weaker people generally.
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Post by alienrace on Sept 10, 2014 18:31:37 GMT -5
ABC is now jumping in the game, though their article is not exactly new news...saying the Ravens "knew what was on the tape". Well duh...
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Post by vosa on Sept 10, 2014 20:47:03 GMT -5
This is beginning to sound like Watergate redux every day. And yet when evaluating the Ray Rice situation one must also considered this. Could Rice be the victim of political correctness?
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Post by highmc2 on Sept 10, 2014 22:29:26 GMT -5
People love it when you lose They love dirty laundry
Enjoy the spectacle.
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Post by highmc2 on Sept 10, 2014 22:41:33 GMT -5
uh...the nfl has a code of conduct? doesn't seem to me that they do...given the thugs and criminals they have on the different teams. Unlike NASCAR and sprint car races where they allow murder on the playing field.
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Post by paintlady on Sept 11, 2014 5:31:07 GMT -5
i know you can't possibly be talking about the ACCIDENT that involved tony stewart. how about...ray lewis?
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Post by shutout on Sept 11, 2014 7:03:13 GMT -5
i know you can't possibly be talking about the ACCIDENT that involved tony stewart. how about...ray lewis? What about Ray Lewis?
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