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Post by aboutwell on Jul 8, 2015 16:23:46 GMT -5
No, I'm just making a general statement... which is true... you are wrong again... as usual... Disingenuity from you. Color me surprised. And I haven't heard Cosby admit to rape... when did he do that?... You don't pay much attention to the news. Go do that. He - in sworn testimony - admitted he gave a woman Quaaludes and then had sex with her. There is no world in which that is not rape. Why should my honesty surprise you?... and no, he didn't admit to rape... when he's charged with it, let me know...
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Post by aboutwell on Jul 8, 2015 16:29:55 GMT -5
"Sexual assaults of men and women who have voluntarily consumed alcohol or drugs is common and not new, being mentioned in the 1938 film Pygmalion.
It is also not new to slip something into somebody's drink to incapacitate them. (See Mickey Finn.) However, in the mid-1990s law enforcement agencies began to see a pattern of women having been surreptitiously drugged for the purpose of sexual assault and rape, particularly through the use of date rape drugs: odorless, tasteless incapacitating drugs that may produce anterograde amnesia."en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_facilitated_sexual_assault
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Post by niamhaine on Jul 9, 2015 5:15:08 GMT -5
"Sexual assaults of men and women who have voluntarily consumed alcohol or drugs is common and not new, being mentioned in the 1938 film Pygmalion.
It is also not new to slip something into somebody's drink to incapacitate them. (See Mickey Finn.) However, in the mid-1990s law enforcement agencies began to see a pattern of women having been surreptitiously drugged for the purpose of sexual assault and rape, particularly through the use of date rape drugs: odorless, tasteless incapacitating drugs that may produce anterograde amnesia."en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_facilitated_sexual_assault ? and..... h-m-m, it does state that law enforcement was involved, so someone must consider drugging someone for the purpose of sex a crime. Does that mean that people going into a bar and getting a beverage are "asking for it"?
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Post by Evil Yoda on Jul 9, 2015 10:01:23 GMT -5
Why should my honesty surprise you?... The first time I see honesty from you would surprise me. I might even have to alert the media. and no, he didn't admit to rape... when he's charged with it, let me know... Go re-read the news. Yeah, he did admit to rape. Unless you regard giving a woman drugs so you can have sex with her as normal dating practice. I certainly hope you do not, but I'm starting to really wonder about you in this regard.
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Post by aboutwell on Jul 9, 2015 11:28:01 GMT -5
"Sexual assaults of men and women who have voluntarily consumed alcohol or drugs is common and not new, being mentioned in the 1938 film Pygmalion.
It is also not new to slip something into somebody's drink to incapacitate them. (See Mickey Finn.) However, in the mid-1990s law enforcement agencies began to see a pattern of women having been surreptitiously drugged for the purpose of sexual assault and rape, particularly through the use of date rape drugs: odorless, tasteless incapacitating drugs that may produce anterograde amnesia."en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_facilitated_sexual_assault ? and..... h-m-m, it does state that law enforcement was involved, so someone must consider drugging someone for the purpose of sex a crime. Does that mean that people going into a bar and getting a beverage are "asking for it"? Some actually are... and long ago I have been the benefactor of such instances... TC comes to mind...
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Post by aboutwell on Jul 9, 2015 11:32:33 GMT -5
Why should my honesty surprise you?... The first time I see honesty from you would surprise me. I might even have to alert the media. and no, he didn't admit to rape... when he's charged with it, let me know... Go re-read the news. Yeah, he did admit to rape. Unless you regard giving a woman drugs so you can have sex with her as normal dating practice. I certainly hope you do not, but I'm starting to really wonder about you in this regard. You've never read ANYTHING other than honesty from me, Sir... and are you sure Cosby say he raped these women?... or did he say something else?... did he consider it rape?... does law enforcement consider it rape?... would I consider getting a woman drunk and having sex with her rape?... no, I wouldn't... and haven't... and I have been guilty of that a time or two... or more... Is alcohol a drug?...
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2015 12:26:32 GMT -5
The first time I see honesty from you would surprise me. I might even have to alert the media. Go re-read the news. Yeah, he did admit to rape. Unless you regard giving a woman drugs so you can have sex with her as normal dating practice. I certainly hope you do not, but I'm starting to really wonder about you in this regard. You've never read ANYTHING other than honesty from me, Sir... and are you sure Cosby say he raped these women?... or did he say something else?... did he consider it rape?... does law enforcement consider it rape?... would I consider getting a woman drunk and having sex with her rape?... no, I wouldn't... and haven't... and I have been guilty of that a time or two... or more... Is alcohol a drug?... If it is and following the logic of some here then I would say that a very large percentage of men on this very thread are "rapists".
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Post by Evil Yoda on Jul 9, 2015 12:29:32 GMT -5
and are you sure Cosby say he raped these women?... or did he say something else?... did he consider it rape?... does law enforcement consider it rape?... You understand this argument is like me saying, "No, I didn't kill him. I put the knife in him, sure. But it was the knife blade that killed him." Law enforcement would reply that by putting the knife blade in him I set in motion the events that led to his death, and they'd be right. You'd say, "He never admitted killing him!" and pretend like that made it okay. Your thinking is very strange. would I consider getting a woman drunk and having sex with her rape?... no, I wouldn't... and haven't... and I have been guilty of that a time or two... or more... I'm sorry to hear that about you. That is a low-class move under the best possible circumstance. You may be fortunate none of your victims ever complained.
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Post by Olive on Jul 9, 2015 16:00:04 GMT -5
Quote
aboutwell said: would I consider getting a woman drunk and having sex with her rape?... no, I wouldn't... and haven't... and I have been guilty of that a time or two... or more...
wow
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Post by kemmer on Jul 9, 2015 23:12:48 GMT -5
Geeze, you can't get a woman drunk without her consent. As a feminist, I believe women have to take responsibility for their behavior. We're not babies who've never heard that alcohol lowers inhibitions, y'know.
Slipping a Quaalude into her drink, however, is something else entirely. That's the act of a predator.
OTOH, saying, "Hey, baby, I've scored some 'ludes-- y'wanna come up to my hotel room and get high?" puts the onus on the woman. In my world, a man you barely know invites you to some private place to get high and all kinds of alarm bells go off. 'Course, I'm old enough to remember when girls were routinely warned that lots of men were "out for only one thing." The advice was: DO NOT EVER go to someone's apartment, bedroom, hotel room, et al, unless you're sure of him. Oh, and don't leave the bar with that cute guy you just met, heading for his car. Something Very Bad might happen to you.
I am very disappointed in Cosby. His stage personna was such a stand-up, family guy-- plus, he used that public trust to lecture others on how to behave. He decided to cast the first stone at "sinners", and lo and behold...
The "America's Greatest Dad" schtick was his gig. Now that it's blown up in his face, he will have to suffer the consequences. Too many of his erstwhile fans are feeling betrayed. When the rap singers say women are "'ho's" to be used, well, they're rap singers with a very different fan base. When Cosby actually treats women like "'ho's", it's time for some tar and feathers. Something about "the higher they climb, the harder they fall" with a good dose of "hell hath no fury."
But, mostly, this story just makes me sad. *sigh*
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Post by aboutwell on Jul 9, 2015 23:26:08 GMT -5
and are you sure Cosby say he raped these women?... or did he say something else?... did he consider it rape?... does law enforcement consider it rape?... You understand this argument is like me saying, "No, I didn't kill him. I put the knife in him, sure. But it was the knife blade that killed him." Law enforcement would reply that by putting the knife blade in him I set in motion the events that led to his death, and they'd be right. You'd say, "He never admitted killing him!" and pretend like that made it okay. Your thinking is very strange. would I consider getting a woman drunk and having sex with her rape?... no, I wouldn't... and haven't... and I have been guilty of that a time or two... or more... I'm sorry to hear that about you. That is a low-class move under the best possible circumstance. You may be fortunate none of your victims ever complained. I guess Jeffrey Dahmer's dad should have been tried and found guilty for putting little Jeffrey in motion... And don't be sorry... all of my "victims" were very well satisfied...
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Post by aboutwell on Jul 9, 2015 23:27:49 GMT -5
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aboutwell said: would I consider getting a woman drunk and having sex with her rape?... no, I wouldn't... and haven't... and I have been guilty of that a time or two... or more...
wow
That's what they said too...
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Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2015 5:27:31 GMT -5
Geeze, you can't get a woman drunk without her consent. As a feminist, I believe women have to take responsibility for their behavior. We're not babies who've never heard that alcohol lowers inhibitions, y'know. Slipping a Quaalude into her drink, however, is something else entirely. That's the act of a predator. OTOH, saying, "Hey, baby, I've scored some 'ludes-- y'wanna come up to my hotel room and get high?" puts the onus on the woman. In my world, a man you barely know invites you to some private place to get high and all kinds of alarm bells go off. 'Course, I'm old enough to remember when girls were routinely warned that lots of men were "out for only one thing." The advice was: DO NOT EVER go to someone's apartment, bedroom, hotel room, et al, unless you're sure of him. Oh, and don't leave the bar with that cute guy you just met, heading for his car. Something Very Bad might happen to you. I am very disappointed in Cosby. His stage personna was such a stand-up, family guy-- plus, he used that public trust to lecture others on how to behave. He decided to cast the first stone at "sinners", and lo and behold... The "America's Greatest Dad" schtick was his gig. Now that it's blown up in his face, he will have to suffer the consequences. Too many of his erstwhile fans are feeling betrayed. When the rap singers say women are "'ho's" to be used, well, they're rap singers with a very different fan base. When Cosby actually treats women like "'ho's", it's time for some tar and feathers. Something about "the higher they climb, the harder they fall" with a good dose of "hell hath no fury." But, mostly, this story just makes me sad. *sigh* An excellent post from a voice of reason. Thank you kemmer.
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Post by Evil Yoda on Jul 10, 2015 11:08:49 GMT -5
I guess Jeffrey Dahmer's dad should have been tried and found guilty for putting little Jeffrey in motion... Grin all you like - but you have made a false analogy here and you probably don't even know why (you didn't spot your error in logic on another thread, either). I'll let you ponder it, you could use the mental workout. And don't be sorry... all of my "victims" were very well satisfied... If you say so.
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Post by aboutwell on Jul 10, 2015 12:04:10 GMT -5
I guess Jeffrey Dahmer's dad should have been tried and found guilty for putting little Jeffrey in motion... Grin all you like - but you have made a false analogy here and you probably don't even know why (you didn't spot your error in logic on another thread, either). I'll let you ponder it, you could use the mental workout. And don't be sorry... all of my "victims" were very well satisfied... If you say so. "I" made a false analogy... you gotta be sht!tt!ng me... (sorry, no other way to put it)... you're the one who started that false analogy crap with your foolish knife comment, Sir... And I do say so...
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Post by Evil Yoda on Jul 10, 2015 13:45:32 GMT -5
"I" made a false analogy... you gotta be sht!tt!ng me... (sorry, no other way to put it)... you're the one who started that false analogy crap with your foolish knife comment, Sir... Sigh. You didn't think hard enough, sorry. Keep working on it.
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Post by aboutwell on Jul 10, 2015 16:22:45 GMT -5
"I" made a false analogy... you gotta be sht!tt!ng me... (sorry, no other way to put it)... you're the one who started that false analogy crap with your foolish knife comment, Sir... Sigh. You didn't think hard enough, sorry. Keep working on it. I know... I'd have to think like you... and life's too short to be that foolish...
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Post by Evil Yoda on Jul 10, 2015 17:16:41 GMT -5
Sigh. You didn't think hard enough, sorry. Keep working on it. I know... I'd have to think like you... and life's too short to be that foolish... This must be "aboutwell" for "I surrender."
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Post by aboutwell on Jul 10, 2015 18:18:12 GMT -5
I know... I'd have to think like you... and life's too short to be that foolish... This must be "aboutwell" for "I surrender." That's how you guys think... when someone sees the wasted effort in talking common sense with you... you claim we have surrendered... we actually just realize that it's a waste of time better spent somewhere else...
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Post by Evil Yoda on Jul 11, 2015 9:18:58 GMT -5
This must be "aboutwell" for "I surrender." That's how you guys think... when someone sees the wasted effort in talking common sense with you... you claim we have surrendered... we actually just realize that it's a waste of time better spent somewhere else... You failed to provide a moral justification for Cosby's behavior. You tried to pretend, without success, that he did not admit on the stand to rape when he did. And then you walked away. How could I look at that as anything but surrender?
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Post by aboutwell on Jul 11, 2015 12:36:31 GMT -5
That's how you guys think... when someone sees the wasted effort in talking common sense with you... you claim we have surrendered... we actually just realize that it's a waste of time better spent somewhere else... You failed to provide a moral justification for Cosby's behavior. You tried to pretend, without success, that he did not admit on the stand to rape when he did. And then you walked away. How could I look at that as anything but surrender? There is no "moral justification" for what Cosby did... nor what I did... and he didn't admit to rape because getting someone drunk or otherwise less resistive... wasn't/isn't always illegal... still isn't...
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2015 14:58:22 GMT -5
That's how you guys think... when someone sees the wasted effort in talking common sense with you... you claim we have surrendered... we actually just realize that it's a waste of time better spent somewhere else... You failed to provide a moral justification for Cosby's behavior. You tried to pretend, without success, that he did not admit on the stand to rape when he did. And then you walked away. How could I look at that as anything but surrender? This is getting silly and you are being pedantic. Cosby, did not admit to rape, he admitted to using 'substances' to loosen his 'ladies' resistance. Immoral and nasty as that maybe is, it is not admitting to rape, that is simply your take on it. You are being disingenuous. I expect this from the likes of redleg, I do not expect it from you. Get back to me when Cosby says "I raped so and so..." and I will apologise to you, till then, quit being a redleg Mk2.
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Post by Ravenchamp on Jul 11, 2015 14:59:56 GMT -5
if the female says NO, and you force it, it's rape
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2015 15:03:11 GMT -5
if the female says NO, and you force it, it's rape You really aren't getting this are you... what If she doesn't say NO?
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Post by Ravenchamp on Jul 11, 2015 15:07:10 GMT -5
morally you don't advantage of passed out
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